Currently Reading

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Basualdo
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Basualdo »

Carlos J wrote:
Basualdo wrote:
Royal24s wrote:
Carlos J wrote:
Basualdo wrote:Stack!! The story of Razzle. By Naomi Wolf

Is there some alternate gag about the drummer and his crash in there as well, Bas?

Anyway, never thought I would get into this - fanfiction. Only because was reading the Jenny Trout recap of EL James' 'The Mister'. Very funny, the recap, the book sounds awful: http://jennytrout.com/?p=12548 James was a fanfiction writer so went on http://www.fanfiction.net for a nose.

As a lover of Holmes went there. Luckily they label the genre under each listing and liking stuff true to the canon, avoided any alternative universe/romance/other shite and kept to mystery/crime. Some very good stuff there, currently on this and liking it a lot: https://www.fanfiction.net/s/13181954/1 ... ke-Mystery

Hvae read some before, just remembered this from page 34: https://talkforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f ... 95#p835474



Do you mean Sherlock Holmes ? I've read them all but I get the titles mixed up.
Tell you what you'd like if you haven't read it :-
The Black Dahlia by James Elroy

I was aware of the actual case which I was taught as an example of how to fuck up a murder investigation, but I only just read the novel. Very good indeed ,and I became so interested in some of the stuff in the fictionalised version that I've started reading a few non fiction works on the case.
Just up your street as a student of the McCann case I'd have thought. Every bit as good as The Staircase or the Jinx and I've encouraged my adult kids to read it just to get a picture of the way people spoke and acted in those days. It paints a much truer picture of the attitudes of WW2 veterans and soldiers in general than people like to imagine now.

James Ellroy is a beast of a writer, I can't recommend him enough. Try the American Tabloid trilogy, you can't tell where the fiction ends. That's if it does.

Yeah, Royals, I've read all Holmes as well. That site has fanfiction using the characters. Some is very good, some absolute shite.

Don't think I've read any, Ellroy, seen some films, thought I had read some, then realised I was thinking about Elmore Leonard. Got a load of Amazon vouchers for Christmas, will look into it, as have read about the Black Dahlia case before.

The adaptation of Ellroy's LA Confidential is one of my favourite movies of all time. One of the very few i'll watch again and again. Its almost as excellent as the book. And very faithful to it up until the end. Though its clear why there's a difference.

And fair play to Russell Crowe and Guy Pearce, both are outstanding, especially Crowe who is just bubbling with barely subdued ... and not even that much of the time....wanton violence. The interrogations and their aftermath is genuinely gripping, edge of your seat stuff. Christ, even the old rapist Spacey (another accuser suicided this week. Awfully conveniently) has to be praised.
Christ, I love that film. I'm gonna watch it again this weekend.
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Carlos J
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Carlos J »

Yeah it is a great film, may have to read the nook. And noted the suicide as well. Also like Pearce in 'Memento', another film I can watch over and over.
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Royal24s
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Royal24s »

I didn't much like the movie, although I didn't give it a chance because after the first ten minutes I thought it was going to be about amateur boxing in the LAPD - but I see you're talking about LA Confidential rather than The Dahlia. I'll watch that.

As I said , I'm very into the Black Dahlia case and I've been able to download the full FBI case file for reference. That's interesting in itself, although of course the fuck ups lie in the LAPD which led the investigation.
I think it's connected to some influencial people and under the counter politics.
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Royal24s
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Royal24s »

Basualdo wrote:
Carlos J wrote:
Basualdo wrote:
Royal24s wrote:
Carlos J wrote:
Basualdo wrote:Stack!! The story of Razzle. By Naomi Wolf

Is there some alternate gag about the drummer and his crash in there as well, Bas?

Anyway, never thought I would get into this - fanfiction. Only because was reading the Jenny Trout recap of EL James' 'The Mister'. Very funny, the recap, the book sounds awful: http://jennytrout.com/?p=12548 James was a fanfiction writer so went on http://www.fanfiction.net for a nose.

As a lover of Holmes went there. Luckily they label the genre under each listing and liking stuff true to the canon, avoided any alternative universe/romance/other shite and kept to mystery/crime. Some very good stuff there, currently on this and liking it a lot: https://www.fanfiction.net/s/13181954/1 ... ke-Mystery

Hvae read some before, just remembered this from page 34: https://talkforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f ... 95#p835474



Do you mean Sherlock Holmes ? I've read them all but I get the titles mixed up.
Tell you what you'd like if you haven't read it :-
The Black Dahlia by James Elroy

I was aware of the actual case which I was taught as an example of how to fuck up a murder investigation, but I only just read the novel. Very good indeed ,and I became so interested in some of the stuff in the fictionalised version that I've started reading a few non fiction works on the case.
Just up your street as a student of the McCann case I'd have thought. Every bit as good as The Staircase or the Jinx and I've encouraged my adult kids to read it just to get a picture of the way people spoke and acted in those days. It paints a much truer picture of the attitudes of WW2 veterans and soldiers in general than people like to imagine now.

James Ellroy is a beast of a writer, I can't recommend him enough. Try the American Tabloid trilogy, you can't tell where the fiction ends. That's if it does.

Yeah, Royals, I've read all Holmes as well. That site has fanfiction using the characters. Some is very good, some absolute shite.

Don't think I've read any, Ellroy, seen some films, thought I had read some, then realised I was thinking about Elmore Leonard. Got a load of Amazon vouchers for Christmas, will look into it, as have read about the Black Dahlia case before.

The adaptation of Ellroy's LA Confidential is one of my favourite movies of all time. One of the very few i'll watch again and again. Its almost as excellent as the book. And very faithful to it up until the end. Though its clear why there's a difference.

And fair play to Russell Crowe and Guy Pearce, both are outstanding, especially Crowe who is just bubbling with barely subdued ... and not even that much of the time....wanton violence. The interrogations and their aftermath is genuinely gripping, edge of your seat stuff. Christ, even the old rapist Spacey (another accuser suicided this week. Awfully conveniently) has to be praised.
Christ, I love that film. I'm gonna watch it again this weekend.




Just bought American Tabloid online upon your recommendation
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Carlos J
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Carlos J »

Just bought 'The Black Dahlia' and 'American Tabloid'. As per, one of my favourite books is this, quite a hard read with the language, but worth it:



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Royal24s
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Royal24s »

Just ordered that as well Carlos. The author is an interesting character I discover.
What's the language problem ? Just LA slang I hope , not Spanish is it ?
I once ordered a Maurice Druon book and it was in the original French.
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Carlos J »

Royal24s wrote:Just ordered that as well Carlos. The author is an interesting character I discover.
What's the language problem ? Just LA slang I hope , not Spanish is it ?
I once ordered a Maurice Druon book and it was in the original French.

Yeah, interesting chap. And yeah, slang. The language takes a while to get used to but worth it. I was going to say like reading 'A Clockwork Orange' but far easier than that so persevere.
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Carlos J »

Some Amazon reviews of 'Homeboy' This chap does go slightly OTT:
Patrick O'Neil
5.0 out of 5 stars Jailhouse patois, junkie chit-chat, cop/criminal interactions, and love
April 3, 2013
Format: Hardcover
I was in New York, on 6th Ave, over by the Village, and my girlfriend Jennifer was, well, she was shopping because... ahhh, because it's New York and that's what she does when we're in NYC. And I was like, "no, no, no, not another trendy boutique, you're on your own." And she goes, "look, it's one of the real housewives of NYC, the cool one." Only I didn't know there were any cool ones, nor did I really know what the hell she was talking about, because when she goes all project runway and real housewives this and that she might as well be speaking in tongues and I don't know or care what the hell she's going on about as I don't watch that kinda bad tv and I'm always suspect of her that she does. Except when I turned around to say something to that affect she's already gone inside and I was all by myself standing on sidewalk wondering which overly dressed trendy woman was the "cool one" because, well, I don't know why? Only then there I was in front of a table full of used books and this tubby Rasta dude was smiling at me.

"Hey," I said, because I felt awkward and I'm slightly socially challenged.

"Buy dis book, mon," he said, handing it to me, never ceasing his huge smile.

I looked at the book in his hand, it was HOMEBOY by Seth Morgan. I'd never heard of it, but when I opened it and read the inside jacket flap: "From a unique new voice on the darker side of American fiction comes a remarkable debut novel of California's mean streets and prison yards." I was totally sold.

"How much, bro?"

"Five dolla, mon."

And yeah, it was NYC and he was selling used books on the street and I could've bargained him down a buck or two, but I just said yeah and handed him a five.

"Wha-da-ya got?" Asked Jenn.

"Bought a book," I said.

And that was it until about four months later and I was home in LA. And I was reading some book review my buddy Craig Clevenger posted on the internet about this guy Seth Morgan, and I was all, "hey, that's the book I bought in New York!" Uh huh. I really did. Well, books get me excited. But I still didn't read it as I was all wrapped up in another book, and it was in a series and, well, yeah. Segue to two weeks ago and I'm back in LA and I'm tired of reading books on my iPad. I mean it's great for travel and all, but I'm home, I want to feel paper and turn pages, and... so yeah, I looked in my book shelf and found HOMEBOY.

Now there are books with their own languages. Like Anthony Burgess' CLOCKWORK ORANGE, and James Joyce's FINNEGANS WAKE, the later of which I must confess I've never been able to read, and hell, Patrick Sean O'Neil and all, I'm Irish enough to brogue with the best of the thick micks. It's just too dense, and convoluted for me to understand (I can be a tad dumb at times). But what I'm getting at here is Morgan's HOMEBOY is in itself in another language, only I know this one well, because I speak it. It's like Morgan's singing my tune. And then on further inspection I discover it's about San Francisco. And he's included the top food groups: heroin, strippers, crime, North Beach, jail, prison, and love - that were the mainstay diet of my quarter century SF experience.

I mean like Morgan's got it down. Jailhouse patois, junkie chit-chat, cop/criminal interactions, and the craziness that only two addicts in love can provide. It was like he'd been there with me. Only Morgan's version is definitely a story - plots, and sub-plots, and full dimensional characters. How I'd never heard of this book before is beyond me. But I'm really glad I didn't go into the boutique with Jennifer that day in New York. I might have missed this book, which is truly special. And I don't say that about too many books.
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More my view:
R. douglas
5.0 out of 5 stars Wretched and Brilliant
December 8, 2004
Format: Paperback
Seth Morgans first and last completed novel is a simultaneously brilliant and uneasy read that like an addiction, first captivates then unravels itself until the reader is rendered helpless to its grimy power.

His story begins deep in the gut of a seedy San Francisco underbelly and ends up ensconsed in the heart of a prison hell. As the story unravels, we are introduced to a smorgasbord of whacked out, grimy, and tragic characters whos' tales gather around us to weave a web of terrifyingly real and sometimes disarmingly surreal situations. The story of 'Homeboy', if it is broken down to its core, is surprisingly simple, but it is told in a way that demands the reader to concentrate. Like the first minutes in a subtitled movie, we are forced to think hard about what we are reading.

But the beauty in 'Homeboy' lies not in the story, but the unbelievable use of the English language. His descriptions of seemingly simple places, people and events are described using words that a terrestrial author would never dream of using. And yet these descriptions paint a picture of incredible detail, you can almost physically smell the stench of wretched human lives steaming out between the cracks of Coldwater Prison and feel the warm chill of heroin as it is pumped through the brittle veins of 'Rings n Things'.

The fact that we will never have the honour of another complete book by Seth Morgan is tragic. But unlike Jeff Buckley and countless other gifted artists taken from us before their time, Seth's death seems somehow apt and befits the legacy of what he has left us described within the well thumbed pages of 'Homeboy'.
5 people found this helpful
This chap didn't like the end so much:
tolarjev
4.0 out of 5 stars It Sucked Me In
23 February 2012 - Published on Amazon.com
Verified Purchase
Normally I prefer a minimalistic writing style which doesn't interfere with the information the book is conveying. So when I started "Homeboy", where every sentence is embellished with adjectives, similes, obscure words, street jargon, and dialect, I thought "Whoa... can I handle 300+ pages of this?".

An example: "Smirkily the Fat Man surveyed the wreckage. He wagged his neckless glabrous head, shivering jowls talced like sugared aspic, and clucked his tongue, his standard expression of avuncular reproof for his girls' each peccadillo."

Within a few pages though, I was sucked into the plot and curious what would happen to the characters. The writing style was entertaining and seemed appropriate for the story involving murder, theft, and blackmail among hookers, pimps and drug dealers in the Tenderloin District of San Francisco. As an obsessive Scrabble player, I enjoyed seeing words I had studied but hadn't seen in print such as "glabrous". But about half-way through the book, it started to drag. The tone shifted to wacky, and I could tell pretty much how it would all turn out. In retrospect, I'm glad I read it, but I would rate the first half with five stars and the second half with three.
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Given away many copies as not got them back and have to keep rebuying as want more people to read it.

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Carlos J
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Carlos J »

Carlos J wrote:Just bought 'The Black Dahlia' and 'American Tabloid'.

'Black Dahlia' just arrived. :D
Maybe she's born with it, maybe it's Maybelline.

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Re: Currently Reading

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Peter Robinson – Many Rivers to Cross (2019)
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Re: Currently Reading

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Carlos J wrote:
Carlos J wrote:Just bought 'The Black Dahlia' and 'American Tabloid'.

'Black Dahlia' just arrived. :D

Brilliant ! I think you'll enjoy that if you stick through the first bit.
I'm now in the middle of American Tabloid and it's quite hard work in parts.

Maybe that's because I've OD'd on non fiction and case papers for real Black Dahlia which leads to other unsolved crimes and corruption in the LAPD during that period.

One absolutely irrelevant but nonetheless interesting outcome from this research is that Ellory's own mother had been murdered in somewhat similar circumstances to Elisabeth Short, ( the black dahlia). I'd say that there was also similar dodgy police activity in that case too, which might have motivated his fictionalised back story of Fire and Ice.
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Carlos J »

Royal24s wrote:
Carlos J wrote:
Carlos J wrote:Just bought 'The Black Dahlia' and 'American Tabloid'.

'Black Dahlia' just arrived. :D

Brilliant ! I think you'll enjoy that if you stick through the first bit.
I'm now in the middle of American Tabloid and it's quite hard work in parts.

Maybe that's because I've OD'd on non fiction and case papers for real Black Dahlia which leads to other unsolved crimes and corruption in the LAPD during that period.

One absolutely irrelevant but nonetheless interesting outcome from this research is that Ellory's own mother had been murdered in somewhat similar circumstances to Elisabeth Short, ( the black dahlia). I'd say that there was also similar dodgy police activity in that case too, which might have motivated his fictionalised back story of Fire and Ice.

Thanks Royals, and yes about Ellroy's mother. Both have now arrived. On holiday next week so will take 'Black Dahlia' with me and report back.

Hope when you read it, you enjoy 'Homeboy'?
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Re: Currently Reading

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Royal24s
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Re: Currently Reading

Post by Royal24s »

Carlos J wrote:
Royal24s wrote:
Carlos J wrote:
Carlos J wrote:Just bought 'The Black Dahlia' and 'American Tabloid'.

'Black Dahlia' just arrived. :D

Brilliant ! I think you'll enjoy that if you stick through the first bit.
I'm now in the middle of American Tabloid and it's quite hard work in parts.

Maybe that's because I've OD'd on non fiction and case papers for real Black Dahlia which leads to other unsolved crimes and corruption in the LAPD during that period.

One absolutely irrelevant but nonetheless interesting outcome from this research is that Ellory's own mother had been murdered in somewhat similar circumstances to Elisabeth Short, ( the black dahlia). I'd say that there was also similar dodgy police activity in that case too, which might have motivated his fictionalised back story of Fire and Ice.

Thanks Royals, and yes about Ellroy's mother. Both have now arrived. On holiday next week so will take 'Black Dahlia' with me and report back.

Hope when you read it, you enjoy 'Homeboy'?



Most interestingly, when looking into some of the events visited in this book many years ago, I started informally referring to JFK and Bobby as ' big brother' and 'little brother', which caught on with colleagues, and I notice that Elroy calls them that.
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Re: Currently Reading

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I also notice that he weaves a LOT of real people into the book, and even though I'm only about half way through I can see that he's going to come up with a JFK assassination theory - more of a plausible reverse engineering of the real suspects and their back stories really.
I'm very intrigued that he's brought Tippet in as a corrupt cop. Of course he was the officer allegedly shot dead by Oswald after the assassination - well I'm convinced that's not true actually - but I've never found any suggestion , never mind evidence, that Tippet was dirty,( and I'd looked for it). Maybe that casts doubt on Ellroy's research and maybe it's a credit to him if he's found something we missed.
The book is definitely hard work, but it's also very good and I'm hoping it'll be worth the effort. Forget my cautionary word that The Black Dahlia was heavy going, cause it's Emmerdale Farm compared to this.
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