High street collapse

[Royal24s]

House of Fraser is the latest large employer to begin the slow process of winding up by closing stores and sacking people.

What needs to happen before people notice the globalists are packing up their belongings and setting off for other places to asset strip ?

So you think the owners are happy to take a hit in the hundreds of millions to move on?
And you think HOF is an example of asset-stripping...as they junk dozens of assets?
It has been badly managed for decades.
I don't know where they taught you economics or business, but you deserve your money back.

Well the economics was in a grammar school many years ago since you ask. Only an A level , but it was the old sort where you couldn't get your dad to do your coursework and you didn't pass by just turning up. I've run a few little businesses down the years and I still dabble in property development , so that's the business bit.
Most people think I'm quite clever at making money actually, but what do I know ?

I think the Chinese owners certainly weren't concerned with re investment , but that's really not the point. It's yet another indicator that people aren't spending money in high streets, where British workers are employed and local businesses supported both by the bigger retailer and money spent locally by staff and customers on their way to and from the shops.

Now the reason they're not spending money ( or paying taxes) is because they haven't got any, and that's because they haven't got jobs, and that's because we don't make stuff or transport it anymore. As a result of today's closures there are another 600 people without jobs or money to spend .

If money is spent on the Internet, it's probably going abroad, and it's certainly not being taxed efficiently .

Your beloved public sector cannot operate without real wealth creation by private businesses within the country including manufacture, agriculture, exports transport and maintainance
because it is funded by taxes. If you believe the bullshit about why it's okay to allow all our wealth to go abroad and get gradually sucked into the control of a few globalists, then I really don't think it's me who's economically naive.

[Hillman avenger]

I've never said I wanted all our wealth to go overseas, but that's not what has happened here.
In fact I have never heard anyone else argue that either.

These guys bought into it unwisely and will take a bath before they are out. Very far from "asset stripping".

As for the internet I am sure some of it goes abroad, but most of it is here. I buy a lot on the internet and the great majority are small UK businesses.

[Royal24s]

Who get the merchandise where ?

[Royal24s]

Anyway I'm sure you don't WANT that, I'm just trying to point out that this is what is happening .
The ifs and buts of individual closures aren't the point, but the trend of closures which are a red light in terms of the economy as a whole.

[Hillman avenger]

The decline in retail is probably down to...

Most people have seen a fall in real incomes over the last 5 years. They simply don't have as much disposable income.

We are still watching unemployment as a prosperity indicator. I understand that 1.5m of the "employed" are on zero-hours contracts, which masks the reality.

The internet- apparently accounts for 30% of sales now; the massive improvement in delivery services hauled up by Amazon as the benchmark.

Some really poor management. For example- the pound shop idea - Ok at first- but Southport , which is a town of only 90,000 , has three "different" pound shops, all with essentially the same offering. Whoever followed into that market had no distinctive offer.

[Royal24s]

Except that they wanted to cash in as much as possible upon the demand for cheap Chinese and far eastern crap as long as people had money to buy it. They can easily go bankrupt at the right point and with creative accounting walk away with the profits but without liability for the debts or responsibility for the social chaos.
I'd say that's not so much poor management as sharp practise , and people do it every day I'm afraid.
It's interesting that you choose this example because it's a very good one of our economy bring mined out for foreign profit.

Now, I know you think that I'm in favour of unregulated capitalism and no public co ordination but that's not quite so. It's the job of government to keep a guiding hand on these matters without trying to run commerce and it's their duty to protect our own people from exploitation from anyone , particularly foreign interests.

Most people don't have the noodle to make their own money,( though it's pretty bloody simple ) and they need employment by someone to make their ambitions possible. Similarly , they are easily hoodwinked by people talking bullshit on these matters and so someone a bit more intelligent and powerful needs to be watching out for them.

Very difficult to achieve that balance you see, because if you just take over you steal the willpower and dignity of the people and then you've done something worse that not protecting them.

[Eaststand]

No they didn't. House of Fraser has always sold good quality gear, but with the advent of the Internet the prices they charged simply didn't wash with the public.

Thats all it is. I don't understand why you make up these hysterical viewpoints. Any logical person can see its just the times they are a changing, and nothing sinister.

Remember TV rental shops? Was their death globalist blah blah blah, or just the world moving on and them having no use in the new world?

Is the death of newspapers a tragedy of epic proportions or simply down the fact we don't need paper any more?

Is the death of jessops and photo development shops down to some unseen mega evil capitalist twats, or down to the fact everyone has a camera up to the standard of something that would have cost £10k in the 90s in their back pocket now and doesn't need any negatives developing?

[Royal24s]

No they didn't. House of Fraser has always sold good quality gear, but with the advent of the Internet the prices they charged simply didn't wash with the public.

Thats all it is. I don't understand why you make up these hysterical viewpoints. Any logical person can see its just the times they are a changing, and nothing sinister.

Remember TV rental shops? Was their death globalist blah blah blah, or just the world moving on and them having no use in the new world?

Is the death of newspapers a tragedy of epic proportions or simply down the fact we don't need paper any more?

Is the death of jessops and photo development shops down to some unseen mega evil capitalist twats, or down to the fact everyone has a camera up to the standard of something that would have cost £10k in the 90s in their back pocket now and doesn't need any negatives developing?

Well you see, there's so much wealth in the economy of any country and it needs to circulate to keep the economy and the country going. Wealth also circulates between countries and that needs to go both ways, but it's not.
It's hard to see why this is difficult really . TV rental shops were replaced by other retailers and photographers were replaced by vendors of digital devices but high street shops are not being replaced by anything and nor are the jobs they created.
If we gradually spend our diminishing incomes buying foreign goods over the Internet we will certainly get cheap trousers and electric drills for a while but those incomes will run dry if there is nothing to replace them. One day the BBC will have to tell you that the NHS is closing down and there will be no electricity because we can't pay for it anymore.

We need, like any country, to protect our own people from such asset stripping, but it seems that a lot of people can't get their heads round that very simple survival thing. Now, if those who should be doing this are instead talking endless bollocks about isms and hob nobbing with the rich and influential members of such organisations as the Bilderberg group we've got a very very big problem coming and I would advise people to try and understand this before it happens .

[Eaststand]

They are being replaced though. Amazon has HUGE warehouses that employ hundreds of thousands of people. And the shop owners can use amazon fba to sell on amazon. Amazon is a high street, it's just millions and millions of different vendors under one roof. Shopify also exists, not to mention hundreds of other money making opportunities.

Just because you don't know about it or understand it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

The high Street is gone because it was shit and no one liked it, and as soon as we got an opportunity to get things cheaper while sitting on the sofa, we took it.

[Sinbad]

They are being replaced though. Amazon has HUGE warehouses that employ hundreds of thousands of people. And the shop owners can use amazon fba to sell on amazon. Amazon is a high street, it's just millions and millions of different vendors under one roof. Shopify also exists, not to mention hundreds of other money making opportunities.

Just because you don't know about it or understand it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

The high Street is gone because it was shit and no one liked it, and as soon as we got an opportunity to get things cheaper while sitting on the sofa, we took it.

Pubs next... Mark my words

[Reg]

Women enjoy hanging around in shops for some reason, so they won’t disappear completely, they will adapt to survive.

[Hillman avenger]

Except that they wanted to cash in as much as possible upon the demand for cheap Chinese and far eastern crap as long as people had money to buy it. They can easily go bankrupt at the right point and with creative accounting walk away with the profits but without liability for the debts or responsibility for the social chaos.
I'd say that's not so much poor management as sharp practise , and people do it every day I'm afraid.
It's interesting that you choose this example because it's a very good one of our economy bring mined out for foreign profit.

Now, I know you think that I'm in favour of unregulated capitalism and no public co ordination but that's not quite so. It's the job of government to keep a guiding hand on these matters without trying to run commerce and it's their duty to protect our own people from exploitation from anyone , particularly foreign interests.

Most people don't have the noodle to make their own money,( though it's pretty bloody simple ) and they need employment by someone to make their ambitions possible. Similarly , they are easily hoodwinked by people talking bullshit on these matters and so someone a bit more intelligent and powerful needs to be watching out for them.

Very difficult to achieve that balance you see, because if you just take over you steal the willpower and dignity of the people and then you've done something worse that not protecting them.

You were talking about the House of Fraser.
HOF would have very few examples of "Chinese crap"
And patently its owners have not been draining off profits to go abroad. There haven't been any.

If you want an example of what you are talking about, our power companies and train operators would be more rewarding. What they have in common is that they were taken out of the public sector for profit and largely ended up in the hands of foreign business. The intervention the government made was to set up that situation.

Ironically those companies came here because of the opportunity to make unregulated profit which they would not be allowed to do in their home country,

[Eaststand]

Next? That's already happened!

[Ralph]

Except that they wanted to cash in as much as possible upon the demand for cheap Chinese and far eastern crap as long as people had money to buy it. They can easily go bankrupt at the right point and with creative accounting walk away with the profits but without liability for the debts or responsibility for the social chaos.
I'd say that's not so much poor management as sharp practise , and people do it every day I'm afraid.
It's interesting that you choose this example because it's a very good one of our economy bring mined out for foreign profit.

Now, I know you think that I'm in favour of unregulated capitalism and no public co ordination but that's not quite so. It's the job of government to keep a guiding hand on these matters without trying to run commerce and it's their duty to protect our own people from exploitation from anyone , particularly foreign interests.

Most people don't have the noodle to make their own money,( though it's pretty bloody simple ) and they need employment by someone to make their ambitions possible. Similarly , they are easily hoodwinked by people talking bullshit on these matters and so someone a bit more intelligent and powerful needs to be watching out for them.

Very difficult to achieve that balance you see, because if you just take over you steal the willpower and dignity of the people and then you've done something worse that not protecting them.

You were talking about the House of Fraser.
HOF would have very few examples of "Chinese crap"
And patently its owners have not been draining off profits to go abroad. There haven't been any.

If you want an example of what you are talking about, our power companies and train operators would be more rewarding. What they have in common is that they were taken out of the public sector for profit and largely ended up in the hands of foreign business. The intervention the government made was to set up that situation.

Ironically those companies came here because of the opportunity to make unregulated profit which they would not be allowed to do in their home country,

In some cases into the hands of foreign governments which makes no sense at all. Profits from our utilities being used to fund public services in other countries. Total madness.

Here’s an idea. Why doesn’t our government run our utilities & use the profits to fund our public services.

[m4rkb]

In some cases into the hands of foreign governments which makes no sense at all. Profits from our utilities being used to fund public services in other countries. Total madness.

Here’s an idea. Why doesn’t our government run our utilities & use the profits to fund our public services.

I have no objection to this in theory and I would be good for all. I'd welcome it with open arms if we could guarantee they wouldn't be hijacked by radical trade unions calling strikes every five minutes as well as guarantee the jobs go to Brits only and aren't handed out on the grounds of some form of positive discrimination or social justice.

The labour voting North would appreciate it most but it'd be interesting to see what Labour in power would do if it ever came about.