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Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 11:51 am
by Roy Twing
Zambo wrote:Hillman avenger wrote:As with the BBC argument, "biased" means "doesn't agree with me"
Parliament has been trying to do its job re Brexit, which is to get an outcome which it judges to be best for the people who elected them.
Johnson has tired to by-pass that because his arguments are so weak and would be, and are, demolished.
Bercow stood up for the process.
If you think that's bias, tough.
The election is the result for Johnson- a totally unsuitable way of resolving the issue, rather than behave like a democrat an ddeal with it.
You are taking the exact opposite view. You think he's impartial because you agree with him, despite overwhelming evidence, just like you don't think the BBC is biased because you are as left as they are. And they fail miserably to defend their position just like you do.
Indeed, - the unique thing about these two examples (Bercow & the bbc) is that they are specifically required to be unbiased.
If they did happen to be biased in favour of topics I agree with though, I would be pleased, given the amount of influence they have, but I wouldn't try to pretend that they aren't in fact biased. That would be just hypocritical and disingenuous.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 4:33 pm
by Hillman avenger
Not "pretending" at all.
I doubt you see it, but there are a lot of people complaining the BBC is pro-Brexit and pro-Tory,
I repeat
Much as you might not like him Bercow has defended our democracy.
No government in my lifetime has so blatantly attacked democracy.
Believe me, Gove for one is lucky not to have been expelled for lying to the House.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 5:30 pm
by Zambo
Hillman avenger wrote:Not "pretending" at all.
I doubt you see it, but there are a lot of people complaining the BBC is pro-Brexit and pro-Tory,
I repeat
Much as you might not like him Bercow has defended our democracy.
No government in my lifetime has so blatantly attacked democracy.
Believe me, Gove for one is lucky not to have been expelled for lying to the House.
Did his upmost to sabotage it more like. Moreover this has nothing to do with like or dislike, it's all to do with the appalling way he carried out his job.
It's absolutely laughable that you don't acknowledge it.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 7:11 pm
by Vespa
Bercow appears to me too delighted to be in the media, it's often forgotten he's a notorious bully to his staff - something I personally find inexcusable. People on power trips, whatever the walk of life, have a low moral watermark.
However, any motions that passed in Parliament that people didn't like - passed with a majority, which is the definition of UK democracy.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:08 pm
by Hillman avenger
Zambo wrote:Hillman avenger wrote:Not "pretending" at all.
I doubt you see it, but there are a lot of people complaining the BBC is pro-Brexit and pro-Tory,
I repeat
Much as you might not like him Bercow has defended our democracy.
No government in my lifetime has so blatantly attacked democracy.
Believe me, Gove for one is lucky not to have been expelled for lying to the House.
Did his upmost to sabotage it more like. Moreover this has nothing to do with like or dislike, it's all to do with the appalling way he carried out his job.
It's absolutely laughable that you don't acknowledge it.
So no surprise there then.
I have no doubt you find it all very frustrating.
Perhaps if the government had a sensible proposal which it could carry through Parliament there's be not need to invoke the democratic process.
Anyway he's gone now.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:10 pm
by Vespa
Hillman avenger wrote:Zambo wrote:Hillman avenger wrote:Not "pretending" at all.
I doubt you see it, but there are a lot of people complaining the BBC is pro-Brexit and pro-Tory,
I repeat
Much as you might not like him Bercow has defended our democracy.
No government in my lifetime has so blatantly attacked democracy.
Believe me, Gove for one is lucky not to have been expelled for lying to the House.
Did his upmost to sabotage it more like. Moreover this has nothing to do with like or dislike, it's all to do with the appalling way he carried out his job.
It's absolutely laughable that you don't acknowledge it.
So no surprise there then.
I have no doubt you find it all very frustrating.
Perhaps if the government had a sensible proposal which it could carry through Parliament there's be not need to invoke the democratic process.
Anyway he's gone now.
The government didn't win a majority, they cobbled together enough votes to form a government they disposed of that majority. The ERG did more to stop Brexit that Bercow did, they have three chances to vote for it.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:29 am
by Zambo
Hillman avenger wrote:Zambo wrote:Hillman avenger wrote:Not "pretending" at all.
I doubt you see it, but there are a lot of people complaining the BBC is pro-Brexit and pro-Tory,
I repeat
Much as you might not like him Bercow has defended our democracy.
No government in my lifetime has so blatantly attacked democracy.
Believe me, Gove for one is lucky not to have been expelled for lying to the House.
Did his upmost to sabotage it more like. Moreover this has nothing to do with like or dislike, it's all to do with the appalling way he carried out his job.
It's absolutely laughable that you don't acknowledge it.
So no surprise there then.
I have no doubt you find it all very frustrating.
Perhaps if the government had a sensible proposal which it could carry through Parliament there's be not need to invoke the democratic process.
Anyway he's gone now.
Yes, I find it frustrating, as I would in the case where anyone in such an important job abused their position to show favouritism. He didn't even have to bother to try and hide it. The rules need changing, so it can't happen again.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:56 am
by Roy Twing
Hillman avenger wrote:Zambo wrote:Hillman avenger wrote:Not "pretending" at all.
I doubt you see it, but there are a lot of people complaining the BBC is pro-Brexit and pro-Tory,
I repeat
Much as you might not like him Bercow has defended our democracy.
No government in my lifetime has so blatantly attacked democracy.
Believe me, Gove for one is lucky not to have been expelled for lying to the House.
Did his upmost to sabotage it more like. Moreover this has nothing to do with like or dislike, it's all to do with the appalling way he carried out his job.
It's absolutely laughable that you don't acknowledge it.
So no surprise there then.
I have no doubt you find it all very frustrating.
Perhaps if the government had a sensible proposal which it could carry through Parliament there's be not need to invoke the democratic process.
Anyway he's gone now.
A parliament filled with people whose sole aim is to prevent the democratic vote to leave the EU from happening.
That parliament never had any intention of passing any proposal that even dared to mention brexit.
To pretend that your parliament was in any way acting honourably or democratically is a disgrace.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:10 pm
by Hillman avenger
Which only shows how little you understand how our democracy works.
As for the voting, go look at the ERG.
You could have had a deal a year ago but for them.
The whole nation jerked around because the Tories can't work as a team.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:10 am
by paolo
Step one completed
The fouling of democracy almost admitted
Step two, muddy the waters and start blaming
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:55 pm
by Vespa
Glad to see he won't be let off the hook
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 6:17 am
by Steve Hunt
Vespa wrote:Glad to see he won't be let off the hook
Haha.
I'd say getting Bercpw on board for election night coverage was an own goal by Sky.
I won't be watching him.
It will either be ITV or Iain Dale on LBC for me now.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 12:38 pm
by Vespa
Steve Hunt wrote:Vespa wrote:Glad to see he won't be let off the hook
Haha.
I'd say getting Bercpw on board for election night coverage was an own goal by Sky.
I won't be watching him.
It will either be ITV or Iain Dale on LBC for me now.
I hope it hounds him. He'll want to dance around and be seen as this great heavyweight figure, but bullying your own staff is inexcusiable.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sat Jul 18, 2020 1:33 pm
by Petingo
God, this fellow is much missed.
Re: John Bercow
Posted: Sat Jul 18, 2020 1:37 pm
by Hillman avenger
Not controversial.
Nobody contests that Grayling is useless.
That's why they wanted him.