Notre Dame

[m4rkb]

You'd prefer it to be that, wouldn't you? If there was a choice between it being a forgetful worker who left a blowtorch on while he went for lunch, and a Muslim somehow lighting a fire without anyone noticing, you'd choose the latter to be true.

There's a massive difference between that and an educated guess.
French churches are being regularly attacked. There is a pattern.

Contractors working in such places aren't generally the types who leave blowtorches on

[Jon Gout]

And there's a massive difference between an attack on a small church, and a large cathedral currently undergoing extensive renovation work.

Even if the investigation proves otherwise, you'll believe what you want to believe, so it doesn't matter what they find the cause to be.

[m4rkb]

I don't know any more than you but I suspect a lot more than you do.
Next time I see someone crowbarring a door I tend to think they're breaking in rather than forgotten their keys.

[Jon Gout]

It's more like seeing a door ajar and instantly assuming a Muslim must have broken in and is currently inside raping the owner.

I'd probably first assume that someone has just forgotten to close the door.

[Roy Twing]

You'd prefer it to be that, wouldn't you? If there was a choice between it being a forgetful worker who left a blowtorch on while he went for lunch, and a Muslim somehow lighting a fire without anyone noticing, you'd choose the latter to be true.

There's a massive difference between that and an educated guess.
French churches are being regularly attacked. There is a pattern.

Contractors working in such places aren't generally the types who leave blowtorches on

I wonder what the first thoughts of some of those who, (for some reason which continues to baffle me) will not bring themselves to think ill of a certain religion, would be if a similar incident had taken place at, say the grand mosque in paris instead?

[m4rkb]

You could easily find out by tuning into the BBC for some speculation.
Sorry no. The BBC doesn't do speculation. They do facts.

[Jon Gout]

I wonder what the first thoughts of some of those who, (for some reason which continues to baffle me) will not bring themselves to think ill of a certain religion, would be if a similar incident had taken place at, say the grand mosque in paris instead?

Because I'm intelligent enough to not allow the actions of one person or a small group of people to influence me to "think ill of" the other 1.5 billion other people who follow the same religion, a similar incident (i.e. a fire with a currently unknown cause in a mosque) would have the same response from me: i.e. nothing. There's nothing to think before a cause has been established.

[Steve Hunt]

It's pointless to speculate at the moment.

The one thing I would say as someone who works in the construction industry is that these incidents can happen when an old building is undergoing refurbishment. It is not uncommon.

Whatever the cause it is an absolute tragedy.

[Roy Twing]

I wonder what the first thoughts of some of those who, (for some reason which continues to baffle me) will not bring themselves to think ill of a certain religion, would be if a similar incident had taken place at, say the grand mosque in paris instead?

Because I'm intelligent enough to not allow the actions of one person or a small group of people to influence me to "think ill of" the other 1.5 billion other people who follow the same religion, a similar incident (i.e. a fire with a currently unknown cause in a mosque) would have the same response from me: i.e. nothing. There's nothing to think before a cause has been established.

So when anything at all happens that could have had a variety of causes, innocent or otherwise, whatever at all that event was, - you never speculate as to the cause?

[Jon Gout]

So when anything at all happens that could have had a variety of causes, innocent or otherwise, whatever at all that event was, - you never speculate as to the cause?

If I was forced to bet on this, I would put my money on it having something to do with the renovation work being carried out. Since no eyewitnesses have claimed to have seen anything suspicious (odd considering just how busy the place was), nobody has claimed responsibility for it, and the renovation work was so extensive... the chances of it being that seem higher than it being an an act of terrorism. And yes, I'd think the same if it was an identical incident at a mosque (I'm equally as non-Christian as I am non-Muslim). I just think it's utterly insane to fuel your own "thinking ill" of a religion based on assumptions you've made, as well as to think something is being covered up just because the investigation into the cause wasn't completed an hour after the hoses stopped.

[Roy Twing]

So when anything at all happens that could have had a variety of causes, innocent or otherwise, whatever at all that event was, - you never speculate as to the cause?

If I was forced to bet on this, I would put my money on it having something to do with the renovation work being carried out. Since no eyewitnesses have claimed to have seen anything suspicious (odd considering just how busy the place was), nobody has claimed responsibility for it, and the renovation work was so extensive... the chances of it being that seem higher than it being an an act of terrorism. And yes, I'd think the same if it was an identical incident at a mosque (I'm equally as non-Christian as I am non-Muslim). I just think it's utterly insane to fuel your own "thinking ill" of a religion based on assumptions you've made, as well as to think something is being covered up just because the investigation into the cause wasn't completed an hour after the hoses stopped.

So would I, to be honest, but it does, as I've said, baffle me that we're all allowed to speculate to our heart's content, as long as the speculation doesn't include certain (and often highly probable) causes.

[Royal24s]

It would seem natural and obvious that a news programme would be asking questions about how such a fire could have started and reached a point where it was out of control.
That's what happens with every fire they report, so we've got to wonder why it's absent this time.

It's also normal that the first question people ask if they hear about any big fire is ," How did it start ?"
Whether that turns out to be the case or not, a series of arson attacks upon Christian Churches in France would have to figure in the mind of a normal person at an early stage.

Those who seek to mitigate or minimise the event reveal their default position.

[Jon Gout]

So would I, to be honest, but it does, as I've said, baffle me that we're all allowed to speculate to our heart's content, as long as the speculation doesn't include certain (and often highly probable) causes.

It's obvious, isn't it? Certain speculations can fuel hostility towards others. Why incite people's already-existent anger towards others if there might be no reason to?

[m4rkb]

So when anything at all happens that could have had a variety of causes, innocent or otherwise, whatever at all that event was, - you never speculate as to the cause?

If I was forced to bet on this, I would put my money on it having something to do with the renovation work being carried out. Since no eyewitnesses have claimed to have seen anything suspicious (odd considering just how busy the place was), nobody has claimed responsibility for it, and the renovation work was so extensive... the chances of it being that seem higher than it being an an act of terrorism. And yes, I'd think the same if it was an identical incident at a mosque (I'm equally as non-Christian as I am non-Muslim). I just think it's utterly insane to fuel your own "thinking ill" of a religion based on assumptions you've made, as well as to think something is being covered up just because the investigation into the cause wasn't completed an hour after the hoses stopped.

Yet again you confuse maligning 1.5billion people with having a go at those so liberal in their outlook they could never countenance of allow anything bad to be said , or in this case and many more - thought!

[Jon Gout]

It would seem natural and obvious that a news programme would be asking questions about how such a fire could have started and reached a point where it was out of control.
That's what happens with every fire they report, so we've got to wonder why it's absent this time.

It isn't absent. It's even on your favourite State Broadcaster.