Nicola Sturgeon

[Royal24s]

I'm sorry, but I support IndyRef2

I think the whole of the UK should be allowed to vote though. If the Union is to break up, surely all those that live in it should have a say?

If I were Scottish, I would vote for independence. I would not want major decisions affecting my country being made by Westminster (much like my views on Brussels/EU). What the fuck does someone like Diane Abbott or Jacob Rees Mogg know about life in the Highlands? Fuck all would be my guess.

No, they should be granted IndyRef2 with the whole of the UK allowed to vote. If it means the end of the Union, so be it. That's democracy for you.

Democracy isn't, we didn't like the first result, so we'll have another. I find your position somewhat inconsistent Steve, bearing in mind what it was on the EU referendum. Let's also not forget, Sturgeon bleats on about independence, but still want's to be ruled by the EU. This is most definitely not a cake and eat it time in politics.

The way I see it is this, Zambo.

The SNP (whose very existence relies on Scotland leaving the Union) pretty much cleaned up last week.
During the 2016 referendum Scotland overwhelmingly voted to Remain.
If Sturgeon, the SNP & the majority of Scots cannot see the contradiction in holding a position of leaving the Union but being in the EU, that's up to them. I couldn't care less.


The last Scottish IndyRef did not allow the rest of us to vote. The one condition Boris should insist on when granting IndyRef2 is that it be a UK referendum.

That is fair, democratic & should put the issue to bed once and for all.

And yes, I'd vote to break up the Union & let them go it alone.

The only trouble with that , Steve, is that if you apply that logic then everyone in the EU should have had a vote on Brexit.
Fact is that they've had their referrendum and ,like Brexit , it must stand. They'll play silly buggers as long as we let them, constantly whining and threatening independence to get more money and attention.
We're all paying for their showboating, so maybe we should reconsider sponsoring them to run a little play parliament and calling it a "government", whilst at the same time having MPs in the real parliament voting on national matters. It should be one thing or the other.

[Royal24s]

What the fuck does someone like Diane Abbott or Jacob Rees Mogg know about life in the Highlands? Fuck all would be my guess

Quite possibly, along everyone else who lives in England. But you'd still let them vote on Scottish independence?

Well I used to own a lot of land and property up there and actually employ a few people,so I think I've got a pretty good idea, yet I live in England.

As a matter of fact the reason for that is that I sold it all in case they won the last referrendum, and I certainly wasn't the only one. I don't think they need another wave of asset dumping and job losses to provide the SNP with another camera opportunity.

In any case, you could apply the same logic to deny Scottish people the right to vote on matters in other parts of the country. We are one nation and so we all get to vote on matters which effect the nation

[subsub]

I used to own a lot of land and property up there and actually employ a few people

ROYALS =

[Zambo]

I'm sorry, but I support IndyRef2

I think the whole of the UK should be allowed to vote though. If the Union is to break up, surely all those that live in it should have a say?

If I were Scottish, I would vote for independence. I would not want major decisions affecting my country being made by Westminster (much like my views on Brussels/EU). What the fuck does someone like Diane Abbott or Jacob Rees Mogg know about life in the Highlands? Fuck all would be my guess.

No, they should be granted IndyRef2 with the whole of the UK allowed to vote. If it means the end of the Union, so be it. That's democracy for you.

Democracy isn't, we didn't like the first result, so we'll have another. I find your position somewhat inconsistent Steve, bearing in mind what it was on the EU referendum. Let's also not forget, Sturgeon bleats on about independence, but still want's to be ruled by the EU. This is most definitely not a cake and eat it time in politics.

The way I see it is this, Zambo.

The SNP (whose very existence relies on Scotland leaving the Union) pretty much cleaned up last week.
During the 2016 referendum Scotland overwhelmingly voted to Remain.
If Sturgeon, the SNP & the majority of Scots cannot see the contradiction in holding a position of leaving the Union but being in the EU, that's up to them. I couldn't care less.

The last Scottish IndyRef did not allow the rest of us to vote. The one condition Boris should insist on when granting IndyRef2 is that it be a UK referendum.

That is fair, democratic & should put the issue to bed once and for all.

And yes, I'd vote to break up the Union & let them go it alone.

I have to disagree about us having a say. The French and the Germans didn't have a vote about the UK staying or leaving the EU.

Personally I couldn't care less whether Scotland go it alone, but when it comes to the next vote, the Scottish people need to have all the facts like we didn't have with the EU referendum. When it comes to devolution, it should not be just down to what the people want, it's what is best for the country, and they are not always best to judge, mainly because they are only told by power made bitches like Sturgeon, want they want them to hear.

[Steve Hunt]

I'm sorry, but I support IndyRef2

I think the whole of the UK should be allowed to vote though. If the Union is to break up, surely all those that live in it should have a say?

If I were Scottish, I would vote for independence. I would not want major decisions affecting my country being made by Westminster (much like my views on Brussels/EU). What the fuck does someone like Diane Abbott or Jacob Rees Mogg know about life in the Highlands? Fuck all would be my guess.

No, they should be granted IndyRef2 with the whole of the UK allowed to vote. If it means the end of the Union, so be it. That's democracy for you.

Democracy isn't, we didn't like the first result, so we'll have another. I find your position somewhat inconsistent Steve, bearing in mind what it was on the EU referendum. Let's also not forget, Sturgeon bleats on about independence, but still want's to be ruled by the EU. This is most definitely not a cake and eat it time in politics.

The way I see it is this, Zambo.

The SNP (whose very existence relies on Scotland leaving the Union) pretty much cleaned up last week.
During the 2016 referendum Scotland overwhelmingly voted to Remain.
If Sturgeon, the SNP & the majority of Scots cannot see the contradiction in holding a position of leaving the Union but being in the EU, that's up to them. I couldn't care less.

The last Scottish IndyRef did not allow the rest of us to vote. The one condition Boris should insist on when granting IndyRef2 is that it be a UK referendum.

That is fair, democratic & should put the issue to bed once and for all.

And yes, I'd vote to break up the Union & let them go it alone.

I have to disagree about us having a say. The French and the Germans didn't have a vote about the UK staying or leaving the EU.

I see what you mean, but the EU is not the Union.

The EU is not a nett financial contributor to the UK. It is the other way round.

Scotland is a nett recipient of Westminster money. Under the Barnett Formula, Scotland receives more money per head than England & Wales. IMO, we should therefore have a say.

[ToRmAtO]

Scotland doesn't have the parliamentary power to hold an official referendum, it can hold a referendum but it would mean nothing as it would not be legal.

For Scotland to have another referendum it would require the UK parliament to approve it, and as neither Tories or Labour want it, it ain't going to happen by an overwhelming majority.

For all those that voted for the Conservative & Unionist Party in last weeks election, that was a huge majority vote to keep the Union a union.

[Steve Hunt]

Scotland doesn't have the parliamentary power to hold an official referendum, it can hold a referendum but it would mean nothing as it would not be legal.

For Scotland to have another referendum it would require the UK parliament to approve it, and as neither Tories or Labour want it, it ain't going to happen by an overwhelming majority.

For all those that voted for the Conservative & Unionist Party in last weeks election, that was a huge majority vote to keep the Union a union.

Torm, surely Sturgeon could hold an 'unofficial' referendum?

A resounding result for leaving the Union couldn't be ignored by anyone claiming to believe in democracy. We are not like the Spanish (re: Catalonia) & I very much doubt it would descend into violence.

[ToRmAtO]

Scotland doesn't have the parliamentary power to hold an official referendum, it can hold a referendum but it would mean nothing as it would not be legal.

For Scotland to have another referendum it would require the UK parliament to approve it, and as neither Tories or Labour want it, it ain't going to happen by an overwhelming majority.

For all those that voted for the Conservative & Unionist Party in last weeks election, that was a huge majority vote to keep the Union a union.

Torm, surely Sturgeon could hold an 'unofficial' referendum?

A resounding result for leaving the Union couldn't be ignored by anyone claiming to believe in democracy. We are not like the Spanish (re: Catalonia) & I very much doubt it would descend into violence.

She could hold a referendum everyday of the year if she wanted, the result would be no more than an opinion poll.

There is nothing the residents of Scotland can do if they want to hold an official referendum, other than the UK parliament approving it; it is a simple as that.

[Royal24s]

How would they pay for that, and how could they implement the result without any money ?

[Steve Hunt]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland- ... s-53987594

Plans for independence vote to be published in draft bill

[shabbado]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland- ... s-53987594

Plans for independence vote to be published in draft bill

2022

[Steve Hunt]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland- ... s-53987594

Plans for independence vote to be published in draft bill

2022

Yeah. No time left during this term.

Assuming Boris relents & gives the go ahead, what do you think the result would be, shabs?

[shabbado]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland- ... s-53987594

Plans for independence vote to be published in draft bill

2022

Yeah. No time left during this term.

Assuming Boris relents & gives the go ahead, what do you think the result would be, shabs?

[shabbado]

Being slightly serious i think we'll see a landslide SNP victory in the Scottish elections next year. They'll get a majority, or very close to a majority. It should be noted that the Scottish parliament was set-up in such a way that a single party majority was 'impossible'

However i don't think Boris or whoever the Tory leader is will allow a 2nd independence referendum despite there being an overwhelming mandate for one.

The reasons are two fold.

Boris wouldn't want to go down in history as the PM who split a 300+ year old Union
Boris and the Tories are cunts and couldn't give a fuck about what the people of Scotland want.

[Steve Hunt]

However i don't think Boris or whoever the Tory leader is will allow a 2nd independence referendum despite there being an overwhelming mandate for one.

The reasons are two fold.

Boris wouldn't want to go down in history as the PM who split a 300+ year old Union

Why not?

I just don't get it. Why is the Union so sacred? I can see why it once was, but not now.

If the Scots want to forge their own path, then bloody good luck to them. I would, if i were Scottish.

The fairest thing to do would be to give the whole of the UK a vote on IndyRef. Boris could pretty much remain neutral if he wanted.

I'd vote to dissolve the Union. I suspect the majority would do likewise.